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Dan Cathy Quote

"Well, guilty as charged. We are very much supportive of the family -- the biblical definition of the family unit. We are a family-owned business, a family-led business, and we are married to our first wives. We give God thanks for that. We intend to stay the course. We know that it might not be popular with everyone, but thank the Lord, we live in a country where we can share our values and operate on biblical principles."

Dan Cathy
CEO of Chik-Fil-A
(who donated millions to "Family Ministries")


( 48 comments — Leave a comment )
Jul. 18th, 2012 01:51 am (UTC)
I feel for any LGBT people born into this family. What horror.
(Deleted comment)
Jul. 20th, 2012 05:22 pm (UTC)
You're both twisting what he was quoted as saying. Typical libs. Do you find yourselves "accepting" everything you see in society? If you say "yes", then you lie, and have no credibility. You'll need to try harder to make him a "demon", because I don't see it, and the majority of society doesn't see it that way. Continue enjoying your gov't-sponsored-conditioning.
Jul. 26th, 2012 05:21 am (UTC)
I'm not sure what it is you believe the two commenters to be "twisting". Can you elaborate?

I think they're simply reacting honestly, and from their hearts, about Mr. Cathy's belief system. There's not that much of an elaboration there. Just what they feel and what they believe.
Jul. 31st, 2012 01:15 am (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
The quote above is incomplete. Prior to Cathy saying, "We intend to stay the course" there is significant dialog absent. I don't believe the comments are twisted, I am stating that the information that they commented on was twisted. That said, I am glad that you mentioned the term, "Belief System." Because, you see, many people are challenging Mr. Cathy's beliefe system only because his beliefs are different and opposing their own belief system. It's a belief system! Each of us has our own, very unique, belief system. Christians who are like Mr. Cathy are firm in their beliefs, as are homosexuals toward their own. The real problem is in the idea of compromise. Gays think hard core Christians should bend a little and the Christian group, well, they just think it's unacceptible. There is no room for compromise in this area between these two groups. Mr. Cathy isn't going to give homosexuality a shot and when a homosexual finds God, the experience doesn't turn them straight. There's only room for tolerence. Mr. Cathy has expressed tolerence by fairly employing homosexuals, which has been demonstrated. Homosexuals, however, are flat-out outraged and are demonstrating against him and his belief system. Where are homosexuals demonstrating the tolerance that they expect from Mr. Cathy?
Jul. 31st, 2012 07:32 am (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
Beautifully said.

The only way I can answer that is to say that employing gay people isn't a choice he's making. What I mean is, the law in California states that you can't fire someone, or refuse to hire someone according to race, gender or sexual experience. So...he actually doesn't have a choice. If someone comes in, and they can do the job, he's have to find a really good (and legal) reason for not hiring them.

On the other hand, by donating money to an organization that spends millions of dollars (not to mention hours of the day) spreading false statistics and challenging equal rights, what he's done there is put his hat in the political ring. He's saying:

"I don't support marriage equality for every American. I think there is a segment of American tax payers, who, because I don't like who they love, don't have the same rights I do."

And that's what the protest is about.
Aug. 2nd, 2012 03:44 pm (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
He also gives to AIDS research which affects countless gay people. Where is the praise.
Aug. 2nd, 2012 08:51 pm (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
AIDS never has been, nor is it now, a Gay Disease. That has absolutely nothing to do with anything.
Aug. 3rd, 2012 01:23 am (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
If HIV/AIDS isn't a homosexual disease, then please explain to me why an active homosexual can't give blood in the US? Or how about the study done in 21 of the major US cities by the Center for Disease Control, where 1 in 5 bi/homosexual men had HIV? I can almost guarantee they don't show stuff like this in the liberal media though, so I won't fault you for your comment.
Aug. 3rd, 2012 07:03 pm (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
I sit on the Board of Directors for "Season of Concern" along with "Broadway Cares", am a member of The National AIDS Foundation, and have been deeply involved in AIDS research since the mid eighties. I know quite a bit about the disease.

And what I mean about it not being a Gay Disease, is that it wasn't "caused" by Gay Men having Gay Sex. That's not a lie and only spread by people who are still living in 1980. And it certainly isn't the only category of people who are living with it (and dying from it). Here's some info for you that might help. From the CDC (we get these reports monthly at very Board meeting):


This might clear some things up for you.

Aug. 4th, 2012 10:05 am (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
Do not put quotations for your own opinion of what Mr. Cathy is stating, this borders being defamation of character.
Aug. 4th, 2012 05:43 pm (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
I apologize. That wasn't my intent. I put the quotation marks around "caused" because it was a term that used often when the disease first came out. I also wanted to show irony. It wasn't meant to be a direct quote.

Sorry about that.
Aug. 2nd, 2012 06:05 am (UTC)
Re: Cathy Quote
Where is the tolerance by homosexuals? It's living with non-homosexuals day in and day out, listening to you tell stories about your dates and spouses day in and day out, but the second we tell the same kinds of stories about ours, it's a "gay" issue. You seemed to have missed the point: Gay people aren't asking for you to do anything differently than you do now in your own personal life -- just let us live ours in peace and security, like everyone else, and with whom we love and who loves us just how we were created. Why is it that heterosexuals feel they need to worry about what gay people are doing or how we live? We don't try to tell you how to live or not live, just to butt out of our personal lives just like we do from yours.
Jul. 25th, 2012 07:09 pm (UTC)
Dan Cathy's quote
Thank you for taking a Biblical stand and realizing Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.
Trust you keep standing on the Word of God.
Jul. 26th, 2012 05:30 am (UTC)
Re: Dan Cathy's quote

Thank you for writing and sharing your views. I appreciate it. And although I know it's just a TV show (and an old one at that), if you have the time, I'd love for you to watch this "West Wing" episode. Not only is it a great performance by Sheen, but it quotes some interesting chapters and verses from the Bible.


I've always wondered what exactly we were supposed to be following when we "Follow The Bible". People seem to pick and choose, and I say: if you're going to follow it to the letter, then you must follow all of it. Not just the parts you like.

Not too many years ago, there was a man named McCarthy who used the Bible to seek out communism in the United States senate. It's also been used to silence women when they wanted the vote, and Blacks when they wanted their freedom. The argument's getting a bit old, and a bit worn out.

I respect your decision to abide by what you believe in your heart to be true and just, but we live in a country where you don't get to force that belief on everyone else. Please keep that in mind when you speak about Jesus and what you think he said.

Thanks again for writing.
Jul. 27th, 2012 09:08 pm (UTC)
Re: Dan Cathy's quote
I'm an agnostic, and even I can see that this was nothing more than a failure to understand scripture, the process, and the fulfillment of scripture.

When people criticize christians for alleged cherry-picking, they rely exclusively on the Old Testament. If the Old Testament was religion as God wanted it to be, then the Bible would've ended with the writings of one of the minor profits...probably Malachi.

And there would've been no need to start a new chapter with Matthew.
Aug. 3rd, 2012 01:43 pm (UTC)
Re: Dan Cathy's quote
Amen to that! Too many people on these forums argue that Christians may as well beat their wives, refrain from shellfish, etc, etc, all because ONE of many verses on homosexuality is found in the Old Testament.

If we were aware of the historical context of this religion, we would understand that the Bible does not stop at the OT, indeed. The New Testament is meant to be followed only by Christians, and OT belongs to Judaism. And if true Christians ONLY follow the NT like they should, critics would realize that there is another NT verse on homosexuality which is where the belief on marriage comes from. (Romans 1:26-27).

So sorry folks, Christians are not fanatical murders who despise shellfish.

On another note, being that I finally found the full Cathy quote on this site, I'm amazed that the first two comments instantly lash out at Cathy for being anti-gay. Did he ever SAY he hated gays?

Answer: Absolutely not.

It's a shame that not even one person can stand up these days saying they support traditional marriage, without being greeted by a volley of media criticism, hateful rhetoric, and massive misunderstanding.
Jul. 25th, 2012 11:46 pm (UTC)
Well done Mr. Cathy! Thank you for standing up to the bigotry and bullying of the radical left wing.
Jul. 26th, 2012 05:38 am (UTC)
The bigotry you may be sensing is reactionary. And I agree with you, I definitively think there is bigotry when it comes to extreme Christianity.

Here's what I mean:

There's a woman in our building who's one of the funniest, kindest and most joyful people I've met in a long, long time. She always asks how my wife is doing and how I'm doing. Just yesterday, we were chatting in the foyer, and she started asking me about my smoking. It's a terrible addiction, and one I'm trying my hardest to give up. She was very sweet and very understanding. She said addiction comes from Satan, and that can be fought and won. I told her I didn't believe in Satan. To which she said:

"That's okay. I'll pray for you anyway."

I asked if she was a Christian and she said yes. I then asked why she didn't have a problem with my marriage, and she said:

"God doesn't judge love, and I'm no better than God."

She's a lovely, kind and gentle woman.

The Christians that I know, that I've met, and that have met me, are wonderful people. They don't judge me, and they don't want to stop me from loving who I love, nor do they want my rights taken away. They believe that God is love, and vice-versa. They leave the final judgment to the Ultimate Judge.

I guess I just feel that if every Christian would take that attitude, there might be less bigotry towards them.

Just a suggestion.

Jul. 27th, 2012 12:35 pm (UTC)
Re: Anon
I must say, I find both of the extreme sides of this fiasco quite apalling. Some of your comments that I read seemed to be pretty extremist, but then I came across this one and must say that I am impressed. This is the kind of Christian I try to be as well. Our church family includes a lesbian couple who have been together for almost thirty years and they are both amazing and inspirational people. I sat down with one of them and asked her how she was able to build such a strong faith base amidst what most LGBT would consider harsh criticism from the average Christian. She gave be some great biblical quotes from both the old and new testament that speak to her. Christians are called to love everyone, just as Jesus did, not turn up their noses to the poor or the different. In fact in His time on earth, he favored spending time with the 'least of these'.

That said, I can't find much fault in Mr. Cathy's comment either. I fail to see how his comment about being a family man and how he feels about his family automatically means that he must hate anyone outside of that definition. I don't know the man personally, but I am married to a man who is the same race as me and have children in what many would consider a 'traditional' way. If I were to comment that I loved my family the way it was and felt it was the perfect family, or said that I wish everyone could have what I have, would that be biggotry since we're heterosexual? Or racist because we're all one race? I just don't understand how commenting on one thing automatically means that you protest anything different.
Aug. 1st, 2012 03:57 pm (UTC)
Re: Anon
God loves everyone. Jesus taught to love your neighbor as yourself. I am a christian. I'll leave the important matters like judging in God 's hands. I think that is what everyone should do.
Aug. 2nd, 2012 01:34 pm (UTC)
Re: Anon
People often confuse love for acceptance of behavior. I have gay friends. I hug them when I see them. I'm genuinely glad to know them and I do call them friends. They've never heard a hateful word out of my mouth towards them. Yet, they know exactly where I stand on the issue of homosexuality as a Christian. God's word and scripture simply have no room for accepting the BEHAVIOR of homosexuality. However, no where in scripture am I ever commanded to HATE homosexuals. It is no different than a friend who commits adultery. I would no more hate him than I would another man for homosexuality. They are behaviors that are against God's word.

What I continually see from those who believe that gay marriage / homosexuality is the demand for the behavior of homosexuality to be "Accepted" as ok. That will never happen from those who actually adhere to what scripture teaches.

They then translate that rejection of the behavior into "intolerance" of the person which simply is a leap of inductive reason that fails evidence and logic.
Aug. 2nd, 2012 08:48 pm (UTC)
Re: Anon
Again, I'm in TOTAL agreement with you. The use of the word "hate" is disdainful. True Christians don't hate anyone. So, I agree. I don't think you hate me. How could you? You don't know me.

And you have every right in the world to disapprove of our "behavior". That actually has absolutely nothing to do with the law. We do not steal (because we are gay), we don't not murder (because we are gay), and we do not break any law...BECAUSE we are gay. That's really the issue. We could go back and forth about your beliefs until we're both blue in the face. You can't argu faith. I know that from myself. I respect what you believe, but again, that's not really the point.

The point is, there is no legal reason (legal reason) to deny a portion of Americans equal rights under the law, simply because you don't like our sexual practice. You have to try (and I know this is an almost impossible task) but try to leave The Bible in your home and in your Church...to the best of your ability. That's the tricky part.

Remember, in every other civil rights case, The Bible was constantly used as a tool. When Black people wanted to be free, The Bible was brought up, when women wanted to vote, The Bible was brought up (women have their place, and that's in the home....the list is endless. The problem is, that never works, because The Bible is only a portion of the country's belief system. Granted, it's HUGE portion of the coutnry, but we all agreed, many years ago, that we would try and seperate the Church from the State.

So, I guess I would say, I don't know that I care how you feel about what I do in bed, I demand the same rights you have with your partner.

And the law has nothing to do with your religious convictions. You can feel however it is you want to feel.

And one last thing, and please don't take offense, but the gay friends you have? The ones you hug? The ones you call friends to their faces? Believe me when I tell you, they are not your friends.
Aug. 3rd, 2012 09:22 pm (UTC)

First of all, i am a Christian, and I agree with mr. Cathy. With that said I don't hate gays or even dislike them. I simply disagree with thier choice for sexual orientation. But I love gay people, just like I love any person of any race, religion or country etc. And as a Christian, I love you. Now you may come back at me and say "How can I love you when I don't know you" But the fact is, I can, and do love you because I know God, and I know His love for me (a filthy sinner) and I know His love for all humans. So because I know His love for YOU, and that he has plans for YOU, and that He fearfully and wonderfully made YOU, and I love HIM, I then love YOU.

Secondly, do you care to elaborate on you last comment "Believe me when I tell you, they are not your friends." I'm not sure how you can come to that conclusion since you do not know ANON or his/her gay friends??

-The Sheriff
Aug. 3rd, 2012 11:58 pm (UTC)
Thank you for that lovely, beautiful sentiment. I mean that, and I really thank you for it. I'm not one of those people in my community who denies the way your heart feels about other humans on the planet. I think it's pure and truthful, and I really do thank you for it.

And the crux of this discussion is really in your first sentence:

"I simply disagree with their choice for sexual orientation."

You believe that who I love is a choice, and I believe it was ordained by God, just as your was.

I met my wife in 1976, and fell in love with her. We were married in 1993 in Chicago with our friends and family in attendance under God's umbrella with all His blessing and love. Think of it this way....would you be okay with us as a couple if we weren't having sex? What if I was unable (paralyzed, or mentally incapable). I know couples, heterosexual couples, who can't have sex for those very reasons. It doesn't make their marriage any less a marriage.

I remember when I told my mother that Chrisanne and I were getting married. She was truly shocked and very upset. The strange thing for me was, she'd known Chrisanne for most of her life. She adored her. They had a wonderful relationship, but suddenly, it became very real, and very frightening.

"People get married to have children." she said to me, very tearfully.

I remember taking her hand and saying as kindly as I could:

"Mom. People get married because they love each other."

And that, for me, has always been the point. If I could chose who I loved, if I could pick, if we take the sexual practice out of the equation, I would still hand pick Chrisanne. No question. But I don't believe in my heart, that my love for her, and hers of me, was cerebral. I believe it's Divine.

I'm a recovering drug addict and an ex-prostitute. I know what sinful behavior is. I have been drug free since 1989, and I am monogamous and loyal since the day I got married. My love is not a choice. Was it for you? Did you DECIDE to love women? How can your love be more blessed by God than mine? I don't think that's a judgment for you to make, not if you really believe the Bible is Holy. There's only one judge, and that's the Almighty. So why not leave it there? If I'm wrong and you're right, then I'll reap what I sow when it's time, but for now, all I'm doing is living a quiet, beautiful and very productive life with the person I've known for over 35 years. I would just very much like to do it legally. The same as you. I'm an American, and I deserve to have those unalienable rights. You can feel any way you like about it, and say anything you need to say about it. I respect that, and I'll defend to the death, your right to say it. Just as I hope you would for me. But that's not really what we're talking about, is it? Not free speech. Not if you search in your heart for the truth about how you actually feel. We're talking about a sexual choice you believe I've made, and you can't support it legally. And when I tell you I'm just like you, that I love and trust and hope and dream just like you, and that my heart went toward this woman, and hers toward mine, all of a sudden, your marriage is okay, and mine isn't.

(Continued below...)
Aug. 3rd, 2012 11:59 pm (UTC)
Re: Sheriff
.....Continued from above...

And so I say, to Anon (and to you, since you asked) that the people I consider friends have certain roles in my life. I tell them my secrets, they come over for dinner, we go to movies, go on picnics, we argue, we disagree, and we eventually make up and laugh our heads off. And we do all of this equally and with complete and total openness. Well....as open as we can, anyway.

And because all of that is true, we were married with 150 of our friends in tow. Would Anon go to her gay friends wedding?

This is why they're not her friends. They may be friendly toward each other, which is wonderful...but I'm friendly with our mail lady, it doesn't make us friends.

The crux of this whole ordeal, and it really is an ordeal...is that there's a large section of Christians that believe if we could simply stop our behavior, our sinful choice, there'd be no problem. I think it's interesting when you look at Christians who DON'T have a problem with marriage equality, and who leave the final judgment up to the Final Judge, and who bless us and wish us well, are "not true Christians". I think that says a lot about where the choice really lies.

It's interesting though to watch the change in the country. As short as 5 years ago, Gay Marriage had few supporters. Polls show now, gay marriage supporters are now the majority. Most of the people who rally against us are 45 years old, or over. The world is changing. Public opinion has switched and will continue to. Not that that has any relevance on how you feel or how you should feel, I mention it only because the sense of "legalizing morality" and separation of Church and State is becoming much more clear.

Remember Sheriff, gay marriage has been legal in 3 Sates in this country for almost 5 years, and nothing terrible has happened. No one "turned gay", the straight families are fine, and people have learned to leave their personal beliefs where they belong: at home, and at church.

And when you think about it, you didn't come out of the womb a Christian. You were taught your beliefs and your faith by your parents, and your religious leaders. And if you ever find it doesn't serve you, if it begins to inhibit your heart, veer you down a path of judgmental behavior and actions, if that ever happens, you can choose to become a Mormon, or a Hindu, or a Buddhist, or a Scientologist (those are some interesting people....wow.) But I don't think if you left your wife, you could ever choose to fall in love with a man. I don't think you were designed that way.

God doesn't make mistakes, Sheriff. He cherishes us. He makes us glorious and in His image. And my marriage and my commitment is holy and blessed by Him. I am very, very lucky. I've chosen to do some awful things in my life, to people I loved very much, but loving Chrisanne wasn't one of them.

And again, thank you for your lovely and kind comment. I really feel you care and I don't for a moment believe you "hate" me.

Or my wife.
Aug. 4th, 2012 12:50 pm (UTC)
Re: Sheriff

First, I want to say thank you for taking the time to share with me your background. And congrats on being clean and no longer a prostitute. I'm so happy for you that you were able to get away from that. Most people never get out of addiction or prostitution. In response I would like to share with you my background as a Christian. And by doing so I'm not proving you wrong or judging you etc. etc. I just want to give you perspective. And at this point I am enjoying this "debate"(conversation). I wanted to comment on your 2nd to last paragraph.
You are right, I did not come out of the womb a Christian, but I also didnt have Christian parents or leaders. My mom always believed in God, but we never went to church. My step dad was Athiest. I've never met my real dad. He beat my mom daily and when I was 2 she finally gathered the courage to leave him and no one we know has seen him or heard from him since. Growing up my step dad was very verbally abusive to me. He constantly told me I was stupid, worthless, an idiot, etc. From the age of 6-7 until I moved out when I was 16. Fast forward to 20 years old. I had everything going for me. I Had purchased my first home, bought a car, had a girlfriend I was crazy about, and had a good job. Then I started losing everything. My gf of 4 years left me and I found out the next day that she was sleeping with a co-worker of hers. I then caught my room mate smoking weed in my house and I kicked him out immediately. Between the 2, i lost $500/month of rent pay and started getting behind on my bills. My elec and gas was shut off. then i got repossesion notices on my truck and home. The thing that killed me though, was the unmanageable feeling of loneliness when I was in my home. I couldnt sleep or eat. Then some friends invited me to hang out for awhile and then go to church with them. So I did, not because of church, after all I was Atheist, but because of human companionship for a few hours. A few hours of not being alone. At the church, A 21 y.o. guy was telling us how God delivered him from a horrible heroin addiction. Now I could not relate to his story in ANY way. I never did drugs or drank alcohol. But somehow, his story was touching my heart. I knelt to the floor and began to cry. 20 mins or so went by and I said softly "God, I am so alone." And the strangest thing happened to me. Immediately I first felt a shock wave go through every cell in my entire body. I can't explain it. Then, I felt 15+ hands on my back. I turned around and saw only 2 people with hands on me praying for me. I focused in on the hands again and without a doubt, there were many more than 2 peoples hands touching my back. Now I would normally never come to this conclusion, but I knew at that moment I had expereinced God. Nobody told me I did, I knew I did. He heard my cry and he answered me. Even though I was an Atheist, he didnt care. He gave me warmth in my heart and peace in my soul the instant I called out to him. And I have never been the same since. That was 4 years ago. I am now married, with a baby girl on the way, I am a firefighter/medic and I help other young adults who are struggling in thier life/marriage.
Again, just wanted to give you my story. Because a LOT of people say that christians are idiots who have been brainwashed (not saying you do).
Aug. 4th, 2012 05:35 pm (UTC)
Re: Sheriff
That was absolutely gorgeous. Truly. What a fighter you are. You have great courage and great strength of character. No wonder.... you're so kind and gentle and true people of God (the ones I've met anyway) are exactly like that. I'm not a bit surprised.

Thank you so very much for sharing that with me. I received your story in a very deep and profound way and I am eternally grateful you gave that to me. And I'm loving our conversation as well, Sheriff. I mean look, it's about both of us, right? What we're doing is what the rest of the country should be doing: We're actually listening to each other.

And of course your vessel (your body) shook. Of course it did. That's what happens when the spirit enters into you. How could it not?

You gave me a great gift today, and I appreciate it. I really do.

Jul. 26th, 2012 09:14 pm (UTC)
He also said "While my family and I believe in the Biblical definition of marriage, we love and respect anyone who disagrees,”

That "family" that one person thanks God (how ironic) they were not born into also has given away tens of millions to children's and is one of the biggest supporters of adoption in the country.

They have not discriminated against customers or employees on any count including sexual preference, but rather have stated their beliefs.

So boycott of you like, but stop short of denigration.
Jul. 28th, 2012 05:50 am (UTC)
I think what both of you may be forgetting is that Mr. Cathy gave millions to a group who's spent years taking down bullying laws for LGBT people, who've kicked our people out of churches, and who've spent many hours picketing, speaking out, and marching against Equality. Mr. Cathy threw his own hat in the political ring, he wasn't dragged there. And when he did that, he alienated not only the gay population, but our straight supporters as well....numbers which grow year by year.

America is undergoing a social change, and that's never easy. For anyone. But when a public company decides to back an organization that steps on the rights of others, those people have the right to fight back. This isn't a case of a simple statement made by a private citizen in the privacy of their own home, or at a dinner party, or even congregating in the public square, this is a company with many legs and many supporters, some of whom, are gay. And now we know where they stand: On the side of inequality. And so having this information, we make our voices heard.

Like any good American.

Aug. 1st, 2012 03:04 pm (UTC)

I think what both of you may be forgetting is that Mr. Cathy gave millions to a group who's spent years taking down bullying laws for LGBT people, who've kicked our people out of churches, and who've spent many hours picketing, speaking out, and marching against Equality.

I bet you purchase gasoline. I bet you've done it for years- a hunch you might say. I wonder if you know at least 8 of the members of OPEC don't just picket gays, don't just kick them out of their churches, but they PUT THEM TO DEATH.

Have fun biking to the grocery store and back- I cant imagine, after knowing this, that you would ever support such a horrendous commodity again.
Aug. 2nd, 2012 08:35 pm (UTC)
I never said I wasn't just as much of a hypocrit as those I rally against. I do my best. I'm not perfect.

I've always said if we did what other civil movements have done,our country would see the light. You know...only spend our money in gay owned and friendly businesses. Only purchase gay friendly and supported prodcuts, and literally, took our money out of the banks, the private companies, and every other business that doesn't completely support equal rights...if we actually did that, the economy would take notice. And struggle. I know how much prejudice there is out there. It's almost too much to think about.

But....we can't seem to let go of our own personal comfort zone. And yes, I'm just as guilty as everyone else. I want equal rights, but no...I'm not willing to give up my car. Although I AM willing to complain about it.

That's a great point you make. I can only say, I'm not perfect. I pick my battles. And the one Mr. Cathy has going, is the one I'm in at the moment. I'll work on the rest.
Bob Williamson
Jul. 27th, 2012 03:26 am (UTC)
Support of the Family = Hate Speech?
If Democrats are outraged over Chick-fil-A's attack on homosexuals (because it supports the advancement of families), shouldn't they be equally outraged over the NAACP's attack on white people (because it supports the advancement of colored people)?

But of course the issue is free speech -- even if someone were offended by Dan Cathy's statement, if the government has the power to punish a business for expressing an opinion that someone official or bureaucrat disapproves of, then what does the First Amendment mean?
Jul. 28th, 2012 06:05 am (UTC)
Re: Support of the Family = Hate Speech?
I agree with you. Yes. We should absolutely be disgusted with some of what the NAACP stands for.

The issue here is only partly about free speech though. Remember, you can't have it both ways. Look at my blog at Tony Perkins quote about Google needing to stay neutral in the marriage equality debate, but cheer leading for Chick-fil-a.

And lets' be clear: we're not really talking about "Pro Family" organizations are we? Name me one thing in the last decade NOM (The National Organization for Marriage) has done for the "family"? Picketing and organizing against marriage equality is about Homosexuality and the fear of men loving other men and having sex with them. It has nothing to do with "the family".

If they wanted to protect the family, they'd be much more concerned with the high divorce rate, or children's care in their own home, or home schooling, or single parent families, instead of recruiting innocent, ignorant people through propaganda and lies in order to try and squelch the equality movement.

Luckily, it's futile, and even they are beginning to understand that. Look at one of the head's of the Republican party and his recent speech about allowing ALL Americans equal protection. Gay Americans are Americans, and you don't get to go after them under the guise of care and concern for the American family. That's what's called A Hate Group. They are motivated not by love of all people, but instead, of hatred of a certain type of people.

So Mr. Cathy's speech is certainly free. He can believe whatever he wants, no one cares. But when he donated to The Family Mission, he bought his way into the political arena. And there he'll stay.


His decision.
Bob Williamson
Jul. 29th, 2012 11:42 pm (UTC)
Re: Support of the Family = Hate Speech?
I've never heard of the National Organization for Marriage, but I do know the Truett's funnel much of their fortune into the Winshape Foundation. (You can donate here: http://www.winshape.org/)

But where in Dan Cathy's quote (the one you cited), does he say anything derogatory about homosexuals? Again, if you're outraged over Chick-fil-A's "attack" on homosexuals (because it supports the advancement of families), shouldn't you be equally outraged over the NAACP's "attack" on white people (because it supports the advancement of colored people)?
Jul. 30th, 2012 07:05 pm (UTC)
Re: Support of the Family = Hate Speech?
That's a very good point, Bob. Let me see if I can clear this up for you to the nest of my ability.

The difference is Chik-fil-a has donated millions to an organization that specializes in creating legislation that prevents gay Americans from having any sort of civil rights:

-We can still be fired for being gay (in most States)

-We have no "right" to be called "family" to our partners, so this affects hospital visitation, funerals, life insurance, and so on.

-It's socially and legally acceptable to be beat up, or raped because we are gay

The Family Ministries along with NOM and Focus on the Family, work tirelessly to make sure these bullet points stay in place: The Hate Crimes Act, Anti-Bullying Laws, Equality in the Workplace, and finally; Marriage Equality. These are all formal laws that have been either shot down, dismissed, or fought against by these Christian organizations, that masquerade as "Family Centered".

They are anti-gay to the core, and have very little to do with anything else right now. I'm sure, as the world changes (which it is) and public opinion turns (which it has) they'll fade away into the annals of prejudicial history our country tries so hard so bypass after the fact. But right now, that's at the heart of what they do and why they exist.

So...that was a long way around why Chik-Fil-A is feeling a backlash. They have linked themselves politically to a very hot social topic by donating millions of dollars in support of a group that is focused on taking away God given rights to a group of Americans they don't like, because they believe we are sinners. Or...what we DO is sinful. The "act" of what we do. And we will know what we're talking about here. About what's really at the core of the displeasure. People who have sex with people of the same gender, can't possibly be in love. We are like drug addicts, murderers, thieves. We sin. We behave badly. And thus, if we just stopped it, if we just did what we were supposed to do, what God had in mind for us, we wouldn't need "special rights". You don't see that as prejudice?

So, let's be perfectly clear here: The NAACP advances black causes but doesn't go out of it's way to legally stifle Caucasian people. The NAACP doesn't try and stomp out laws to prevent white people from having equal rights. There's a big difference between what they do, and what NOM, Family Ministries and Focus do.

I agree. I'd love to be in the forefront of helping the family. Of the advancement of a good, kind, understanding and thoughtful family and the beauty and kindness that produces. But what I don't understand is why that has anything to do trying to prevent other families from finding their own voice. Just because they live in ways that differ from yours, is that any reason to spend time trying to silence them and strip them of their American life?

Seems to me that's the farthest thing from The Bible I've ever heard.
Jul. 30th, 2012 07:12 pm (UTC)
Re: Support of the Family = Hate Speech?
...and please, please don't misunderstand me: I have no doubt these organizations are doing what they believe to be right. I don't think they "hate" us. I'm not one of those people who believe that's true. That's an awful word and it's sorely overused.

I believe their faith is so strong and so powerful that it tends to blind them just a bit when it comes to over-reaching their moral compass. What I mean is: These organizations should focus their Biblical principals where they'll do the most good, In Their Own Home. That's where their gifts will shine the most, and they won't hurt anyone else.
Jul. 27th, 2012 05:00 pm (UTC)
In God we trust!
I LOVE THE ABILITY TO STAND ON OUR BELIEFS AND HAVE THE FREEDOM TO DO SO! To say there is hate in his statement is complete ignorance, there is a belief in the WORD OF GOD! Our country was founded on Christianity, those who choose to continue that belief, are as entitled, as those whom choose not too! I don't hate others for their views, I would assume no one would hate me for mine! I love and adore all individuals, however I stand on a belief given to me by God, on the definition of marriage. Because I don't agree with my husband on his choices of sports teams does not mean I hate him, it means we do not agree, I happily agree to disagree! God Bless you all and know you are all loved!
Jul. 28th, 2012 05:42 am (UTC)
Re: In God we trust!
You know, I agree with you. The word "Hate" has really been thrown around far to easily for me.

I don't believe you hate me. I certainly don't hate you. How could we hate each other? We don't know enough about each other to feel that strongly one way or another. So, let's leave Hate out of this completely.

The main point here is not what you believe or what I believe. The point is: What is Law? That's the question. When do our spiritual beliefs coincide with the laws of our country? That's the precipice on which our country stands at the moment, and all of us are struggling with it.

And so...unfortunately, you're dealing with a new generation that couldn't care less about whether gay people fall in love or don't. And this is where the tide turns. Statistics are on the side of change, they always have been. That's why we're the greatest country on earth. We change. We grow. We accept each other and we keep going forward. That's why we're Americans.

And one last thing, your husband's decision to watch sports on TV, has nothing to do with who I fall in love with. One is a decision, the other is an affair of the heart. You must know the difference, I'm assuming you love your husband more than anything else in the world and would move heaven and earth for him. I know I would for my wife. I know a lot of your information has to do with our sex lives, but we want to be with the person we love. We can already have sex with whomever we want.

So can you, for that matter.

We're talking about a legal commitment between two consenting adults, because they want to share their lives, their hearts, their property, and they want to be heard. To deny a population those rights is not only sad, it's undignified.

Soon, you'll have to live your gay neighbors and relatives in a peaceful, kind and accepting way. You don't ever have to like it. And you don't ever have to understand it. That's okay. We don't understand you either.

Think about your own life for just a moment: You choose God, you fell in love with your husband. Just be with that.

Thank you for writing and for being so kind and gentle. I appreciate it.

Jul. 28th, 2012 01:50 pm (UTC)
The Bible; self-righteousness; judge not
The quote from Mr. Cathy represents a stance and spirit so far from Jesus Christ's life, love and example. I do not even know where to begin. The only true Biblical reference to homosexuality is in Leviticus, so i have included an excerpt of a letter to Dr Laura Schlessinger regarding this issue as follows to illustrate my point:
1. Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can’t I own Canadians?
2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of Menstrual uncleanliness – Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord – Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death.  Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should I ask the police to do it?
6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don’t agree. Can you settle this? Are there ‘degrees’ of abomination?
7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?
8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?
9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn’t we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
Aug. 3rd, 2012 02:21 pm (UTC)
Re: The Bible; self-righteousness; judge not
Read the New Testament... not just the Old. They work together as one. You've clearly missed the point of what Jesus did for us by dying for us. As it reads... He came to fulfill the law... the laws which you've pointed out. You should also research the original text to find out what word was actually used. Many of the greek and hebrew words can't be translated properly in english. Or, different words have been translated to the same word even though they mean completely different things.

With the sacrifice that was Jesus, we are no longer under the rule of those laws. We have been spared God's wrath because Jesus took it all at the cross.
Aug. 3rd, 2012 06:45 pm (UTC)
Re: The Bible; self-righteousness; judge not
How convenient.

However...you still can't make laws around morality. Let's stick to the subject, if we can. You guys will pick and chose in The Bible until the cows come home. It's a pointless debate. Let's talk about the real issue.
Aug. 3rd, 2012 11:51 pm (UTC)
Re: The Bible; self-righteousness; judge not
Isn't the real issue the matter of freedom of speech? whether we like/agree with it or not?!
Jul. 30th, 2012 07:56 pm (UTC)
I keep seeing this point being made about the United States being founded on Christianity. The words "Jesus Christ, Christianity, Bible, Creator, Divine, or God," appear nowhere in the Constitution. The founders were very precise and particular about the wording in that document. It's no oversight that they left those words out. There's nothing in the Constitution that's left for inference. I don't get where the idea of a "Christian Nation" comes from.
Aug. 3rd, 2012 02:14 pm (UTC)
Read the Pre-amble please...
The word Creator is used in the pre-amble to the constitution. But, you should realize that most of the men that wrote our founding documents where Christians and they used the principles taught in the Bible in what they wrote. I wouldn't say we're Christian nation perse, but America was built on Christian values and principles... much like CFA.
Aug. 3rd, 2012 10:51 pm (UTC)
The Sheriff

Just a couple of fyis...The Pre-amble to the constitution does not include the word 'Creator'. The Constitution's pre-amble is "We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense,promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.".

I believe you may be mixing this up with those hallowed words in the Declaration of Independence, to wit, "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." Lovely indeed.

The Declaration of Independence was an expression of the, then, colonial "American" minds view of their political repression at the hands of their King and government-The English Parliament. It was a declaration to the other world governments-most of which were still running on a Monarchy-that separating from England and establishing a republic was a Natural Right as given to any Property Holding Man (woman were not included, nor were non property holders or people of African decent). Mr. Jefferson, known for his own liberality when it came to religion (see The Virginia Act For Establishing Religious Freedom), purposely used the words "THEIR Creator" to include religious beliefs of all stripes, including Jew and Gentile, Islam and Buddhism and those not yet thought up (Mormon, Jehovah's Witness, and all the other Protestant Christian groups that came into being AFTER the DOI was written).

Chrisanne-Alex's wife
Aug. 6th, 2012 01:31 am (UTC)
Dan Cathy never mentioned gays...
Why didn't you post the whole conversation which by the way was an interview about his religious views by a Christian Newspaper. If it's too much trouble to post the truth, I'll help you out...

“We don’t claim to be a Christian business,” Cathy told the Biblical Recorder in a recent visit to North Carolina. He attended a business leadership conference many years ago where he heard Christian businessman Fred Roach say, “There is no such thing as a Christian business.”

“That got my attention,” Cathy said. Roach went on to say, “Christ never died for a corporation. He died for you and me.”

“In that spirit … [Christianity] is about a personal relationship. Companies are not lost or saved, but certainly individuals are,” Cathy added. “But as an organization we can operate on biblical principles. So that is what we claim to be. [We are] based on biblical principles, asking God and pleading with God to give us wisdom on decisions we make about people and the programs and partnerships we have. And He has blessed us.”

And the marriage thing?

The company invests in Christian growth and ministry through its WinShape Foundation (WinShape.com). The name comes from the idea of shaping people to be winners. It began as a college scholarship and expanded to a foster care program, an international ministry, and a conference and retreat center modeled after the Billy Graham Training Center at the Cove.

“That morphed into a marriage program in conjunction with national marriage ministries,” Cathy added.

Some have opposed the company’s support of the traditional family. “Well, guilty as charged,” said Cathy when asked about the company’s position. “We are very much supportive of the family — the biblical definition of the family unit. …

“We are very much committed to that,” Cathy emphasized. “We intend to stay the course,” he said. “We know that it might not be popular with everyone, but thank the Lord, we live in a country where we can share our values and operate on biblical principles.”

Aug. 6th, 2012 07:44 am (UTC)
Re: Dan Cathy never mentioned gays...
Thank you for posting the entire quote. I hadn't heard all of it, and I appreciate it.

I wasn't trying to lie, I was simply posting what I found. I don't think calling me a liar makes much sense, nor does it really serve a healthy conversation.

But thanks for the quote anyway.
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